(no subject)

[heidi]

This is probably the most difficult post I've made here on LJ in a long time, if ever.

This morning, nostrademons emailed me and praetorianguard regarding some IP matches that he did using information posted on recent Charlotte Lennox posts on JournalFen and comments to those posts.

On JournalFen, el juno posted 68.82.43.3 as the address they have at JournalFen associated with Sporkify - as far as nostrademons, praetorianguard and I can tell, this is the first time that IP address has been publicly shared as a "sockpuppet" IP address. nostrademons ran it through FA's archives, and found that it did match the IP address used by MsScribe on FA in the winter and spring of 2004.

Back in March of 2004, when I was told that many GT'ers thought that Sporkify was an FA Mod, I did ask on the Yahoogroup we have for mod-organizational things whether anyone on said list was Sporkify, and MsScribe lied to me. She posted a reply and said that people thought it was someone on her flist, and then said, "Did they wank something else? *goes to look*"

I believed her, just as I believed all the other FA Mods who posted to that list that week and said they weren't Sporkify - and of course, everyone but MsScribe answered truthfully. But I believed her, and praetorianguard believed her, and so did everyone else. After that, there was one more wank posted by Sporkify on F_W - this one actually involved wanking about FA and some of its mods - and at almost the same time, MsScribe asked if she could resign from FA. I, of course, said yes, and she stopped modding on FA. She was on-staff from early June, 2003 (when I was on leave having my son Jon, then working on Nimbus) until late March, 2004, and in that time-frame was on leave for most of November and December.

Now, I know people are going to say that we should've figured this out before, but we had no information about Sporkify's IP address, and we had no expectation that JF would ever release it, because their ToU's Privacy Policy states, "Journalfen will never release your personal
information, to anyone, except as may be required by law, or in the course of any possible legal proceedings.... Journalfen will never sell, or otherwise make available, information that is not required for the normal display of your journal."

Back in the spring of 2003, praetorianguard and owlman tried to make it clear that FA mods were not acting for FA when they weren't posting on the site, and that only the two of them and I were authorized to act on behalf of FA off-site. Therefore, unless someone complained about MsScribe as an FA moderator or she violated the FA ToU in some way, none of this involved FA. At that time, nobody directly contacted me about it, afaik.

Personally, I am sorry anyone was hurt by anything that has happened in fandom over the last six years that I've been a part of it. I feel extremely duped and upset about this whole situation. That being said, I am all written-out at this point, and so I'm going to parrot Irina. It's so hard to understand how someone who has been so kind to me, and whom I've seen be kind to others, could also do this - could be untruthful directly to me.

I don't think I've ever posted anything publicly or semi-publicly to hurt any of the GT users. I am friends with people who had fics there, and who posted there, and I would never want to hurt them, or anyone else who was an innocent victim of anything or anyone, and I know everyone else on FA's org team feels the same way.

If I have, I apologize for it. All these years, I've thought this was something that had nothing to do with me, or with FictionAlley and I really still feel that 99% of it didn't - we don't have any conclusive information to add to the discussion regarding Fermatojam or Pottersginny, according to the investigating that nostrademons did of our database.

Comments

[hermorrine.livejournal.com]

We obviously don't know the same people, because that's not what I'm seeing at all. I'm seeing people pointing and laughing, making fun of this and reveling in the meanspiritedness. It's 'Hey, Harry Potter Fandom is wankier than XYZ fandom!' time again.

I'd like to believe that this will somehow make things happy and shiny in the future, but I doubt it will.

[chocolatepot.livejournal.com]

Maybe you've missed the ex-GTers in this post who are commending Heidi for making it?

[hermorrine.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't have a clue if a person was a GTer, an FAer, an SQer or anything, so apparently I have.

[chocolatepot.livejournal.com]

Well, then, have you actually read Charlotte's posts? Because people get named and people name themselves in the comments. PiperX, Agonistes, Doctor Aicha and Ashavah were all involved with SQ and/or GT and are here in the comments. FAers would include Flourish, Heidi, and Nostrademons.

[ivyblossom.livejournal.com]

We're not all missing that, FYI. I'm not seeing any pointing and laughing, but maybe I have all the wrong people on my flist. None of this is funny on either side of the argument, I can't imagine. I don't know why it's coming out now, but I personally would like to see truth keep coming out, no matter which "side" or area of fandom gets implicated.

[gunderpants.livejournal.com]

As an aside, I started laughing at first. Then the laughter kinda turned to that slack, open-mouthed horror you usually have when you realise there's a reason why you need to turn off the stove when you leave your house.

I've seen a lot of really good stuff come out of this: people apologising to each other (like Heidi here) and harmonians getting along with other shippers over at JF. It mightn't be anything huge, but it has at least allowed people to understand the history of the situation better and reconcile differences.

[edeainfj.livejournal.com]

Don't you know that the truth is only relevant and worth telling within one to two years of the events in question? ;)

[athenaps.livejournal.com]

Is there a statue of limitations on the truth now? :)

[chocolatepot.livejournal.com]

I haven't really been following this anywhere except the source, really, as all of the people who would write about it on my flist are at bad_penny anyway.

Thanks for agreeing. I was worried that I was coming off as stupid and confrontational.

[bookshop.livejournal.com]

I've been following the comments on JF since the first post, and I think the commenters there have pretty much collectively experienced a growing feeling of horror combined with sympathy. The laughter has been more or less occasional.

I think the whole thing has been a healing event for a lot of people. Heidi's post certainly opens doors, I think, to a lot more healing.

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

Honestly, that's what I see too. People who weren't even in the fandom at the time are asked to pick sides, and defriend people in full "with us or against us"-mentality.

I do think there is a lesson to be learned from this particular piece of fandom history, which is that everyone should think for themselves, instead of letting other people think for them, and just jump on the bandwagon. Also that maybe we shouldn't be so quick to jump to conclusions, and self-righteously condemning others, rather than question if we might be, you know, not a hundred per cent in the right ourselves. And yet, from what I've seen of the comments on JF (and in the journal of some big F_W'er), is that people keep responding to this wank by doing just that. Lesson has, in other words, gone completely over most people's heads, and thus I doubt fandom will "heal" any time soon.

[anatsuno.livejournal.com]

fandom has a whole is made of people, and there will always be idiots, and/or normal non idiotic people making mistakes. maybe fandom as a whole will not heal, but *some of the precise people* hurt badly years earlier can now start to heal, and THAT is important, whether or not newer people or hot-headed fandomers jump the gun on the side. In other words, yes there might be may negative consequences to this getting posted, but none of them invalidate the existence of positive consequences as well.

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

but *some of the precise people* hurt badly years earlier can now start to heal, and THAT is important, whether or not newer people or hot-headed fandomers jump the gun on the side.

I agree with you there, and if those exact people (like the GT admins?) get closure out of this, that's a good thing. I just don't like how people who weren't directly affected, seem to take this opportunity to join the lynch-mob and drag in people who weren't even there, or at least weren't involved. (It's especially annoying when people who have their own skeletons in the wardrobe do this.) And my point is that that will probably sow more even more discord, which is unnecessary, when it could just be about the people who were there and affected and hurt, coming to terms with what actually happened.

[anatsuno.livejournal.com]

It could, in an ideal world perhaps. in this real and messy one, like i said, maybe new wounds will be created from this, but that does not invalidate the healing going on. and I'm sorry if like so many others i tend to think that if there had not been a big public outcry/reaction/wank/something, Heidi and Fa people might *still* not know /think / want to check on the IP.

speculating is a little useless (a lot even) but i doubt that if el Juno had unearthed those IPs and emailed Heidi to ask her to check for them in FA logs in relation with Msscribe, she would have heeded that request, you know?

So anyway, this is how it went down, and it still goes down. Chips fall, some people cry. but there is healing going on too, and that was all i meant to point out, because some people are still denying that.

[heidi8.livejournal.com]

but i doubt that if el Juno had unearthed those IPs and emailed Heidi to ask her to check for them in FA logs in relation with Msscribe, she would have heeded that request, you know?

I would have. There have been instances in the last five-ish years where FA's been asked to investigate something, whether it's been a plagiarism of an author's fanfic or an ex- boyfriend-doing-some-stalking and we've always done so. Over the years I have suspended a mod for violating the FA ToU and asked another mod to leave for breaching confidentiality. But these incidents have always only been disclosed to the parties who were involved.

[wildebeth.livejournal.com]

For the record, I was on the very edge of the fandom, but I was angry on behalf of msscribe when I ignorantly believed her and those defending her. I even went so far as to snipe blindly at someone who didn't deserve it. This thing has given me a chance to apologize to that person.

Friendships were ruined, people left the fandom and livejournal, and then there were the 'little people' who were indirectly affected. Think of the whole Charity thing. Lots of people (those directly involved, especially) have truly appreciated the new information. The conclusive information. Sure, the queen has retreated to her special little corner away from fandom, but enough people have been positively affected by this that the shits-and-giggles-seekers are meaningless.

Like a lot of people have been saying, the truth can hurt, but not nearly as much as a festering web of lies. I don't see a lot of people sowing discord. This is probably because the subject is the one who has sown the most, and it's doubtful that she would respond.

And with that, I'm shutting up. :x

[ishtar79.livejournal.com]

Honestly, that's what I see too. People who weren't even in the fandom at the time are asked to pick sides, and defriend people in full "with us or against us"-mentality.

Yes, that's the most amusing part, isn't it? They somehow manage to make it all about them. That level of self-absorption is almost admirable.

Lesson has, in other words, gone completely over most people's heads, and thus I doubt fandom will "heal" any time soon.

And you're what, surprised by this? ;)

Fat chance of fandom 'healing', even if that *was* the original intent behind all this digging up of three year-old wank. People are going to be jumping to conclusion and following mob mentality. The only thing that ultimately changes is *which* mob they follow.

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

And you're what, surprised by this? ;)

Heh, not particulary, no. ;P I've watched different fandoms, at least as a lurker, since 1998, my conclusion is that if fandom "evolves" it tends to be for the worse, not the better. Yeah, the question is which mob to follow, because if you follow the "right" one, you've apparently proved yourself as a Good Person in the eyes of yourself, and the world. Or something.

Anyway, not sure if I'll get around to update my own lj tonight, so in case I don't, I wish you the best birthday ever!

♥ ♥ ♥ &Hearts; ♥

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's definitely something it would be great if fandom could do. Let's face it, it's hard. There's often a lot of pressure to take sides, and sometimes it's the right thing to do. I can remember more than one situation where someone was lying and the person who checked the liar out was attacked by friends of the liar who honestly felt that person was being attacked.

It's never a bad thing for the real story to be told--it's just so hard on the Internet where every true story has 200 random people looking to use it to their own advantage, for notoriety, for amusement, for spite, for personal vindication.

Getting the truth out is a good thing, but this makes me want to also be doubly careful about treating people well just on a regular basis.

[heidi8.livejournal.com]

I've been reading through some emails on the mods-of-HPfGU list today, to refresh my memory about some of that list's chronology in April and May of 03, and in the world of irony, I've found posts I made about hatred of factions, and the assumption that people aren't individuals but rather representatives of one faction or the other. And I've always tried to have friends across the fandom and it's been *difficult* - it was difficult before Spring of 03 - and the tiny-little-untruths that show up in so many places, I'm afraid, are a large part of that.

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

I've found posts I made about hatred of factions, and the assumption that people aren't individuals but rather representatives of one faction or the other.

That sounds interesting, any chance of a link, or is it a locked post?

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

Yeah, word.

[effervescent.livejournal.com]

I know that's something that has irritated me quite a bit. I want something that's obviously so painful for the people involved to actually mean something, and to see the people who are talking about this 'meaning something' go on to be so judgemental really bothers me. Let the truth come out, but don't perpetuate all the mistakes that happened during it by attacking the people who attacked those people, etc. That doesn't do any good.

[go-back-chief.livejournal.com]

Yes, you said it better, and more to the point, than I could. :-)

[mcity.livejournal.com]

It's 'Hey, Harry Potter Fandom is wankier than XYZ fandom!' time again.

As one of the members of F_W, most of the reaction is either "Holy crap, she went through a lot of trouble", "Wow, that's a lot of research. Can't wait for the movie.", or some vombination of the two. Very little actual pointing and laughing.