A musing on online communities

[heidi]

I'm having a discussion in private email with someone who's been in sf/fantasy fandoms for about 8 years, and who thinks that as I've only been in the HP fandom for just over 2 years, and wasn't involved with any online - or offline! - sf/fantasy fandoms before that, that I just don't understand how certain sf/fantasy fandom things work.

Point taken, and this isn't really about that, and yes, I know that some of you will frown on me for summarizing a private email conversation here on my LJ without the prior consent of the person I'm corresponding with - but I didn't do it for any reason, other than to provide a backstory for why this is on my mind (and how is it any different from summarizing a real life conversation, anyway?).

This post is about community - specifically, online communities.

In about 6 weeks, I'll be hitting my 10th anniversary of being online. Admittedly, my first three months were entirely AOL - then I discovered CompuServe and about a year later, Prodigy. And here's a brief list of the online communities I've been involved with since I started (am attempting to stay in order):

The Legal Forums on AOL and the CNI listserv
Court TV
Tongue in the Mail/Frenz (Crowded House)
Killermont Street (Aztec Camera)
the tv show Friends (1994-1995)
The Friends Zone (an off topic offshoot of the show, started in early 1995 and still going on)
The rec.arts.disney RPG and rec.arts.disney.parks in general
alt.wedding and soc.couples.weddings
TheKnot.com
BabyCenter's July 1999 Moms board and list
and of course... Harry Potter

More than some, less than others, clearly. But it's about 10 years of online communities - some fascinating - and others, that I looked at and had a harder time getting into, like SportsNight and the SW:TPM ones, aren't even mentioned above because I never really felt like I was *in* those communities, just sort of looking at them from the outside.

This discussion I've been having has made me wonder, though - are we a fandom or are we a community? Or are we a fandom that contains a number of communities?

And do we, in fact, have anyone who could be considered "fandom management" with "official titles"? Yes, I know many of you will shout, "Heidi! You are fandom management! You have an official title at both FA and HPfGU!"

But the fandom isn't just FA & HPfGU. And I really have no stake in the "management" of the fandom as a whole - just a small role on one listserv and a slightly larger one on one site - but less control than many of you probably think! If you see HP as a fandom and not just a series of unrelated communities, is there anyone who has a management role, overall?

And do I really, really, need a vacation?

Comments

[ina]

Is there really a difference between a fandom and a community? I thought the definition of fandom was "a community of fans". And everybody who says about him/herself that he/she is in the fandom *is*. Of course you have smaller circles in the whole as well, like I am in the H/D circle. Other circles incorporate more that one specific fandom like I am part of the slash fandom in general (not just HP) or the fanfiction fandom.

And I don't think anyone is the HP fandom management, I don't think any fandom has that. Owners of popular sites and list have of course more influence and there are such things as traditions, which each fandom develops or adapts from other older fandoms. But still it's the decision of each individual fan what he wants to do in the fandom.
Organisations in fandom get managed, but they are not the whole of fandom and most have more than one anyway.

As for old versus new fandom, it is surely helpful to fall back on traditions that developed in other fandoms and there is a reason why they are traditions but new fandoms always get new ideas in the general fandom as well. And each fandom is unique in it's own way.

[frances-potter.livejournal.com]

I had a similar conversation with a RL friend at the weekend when I was trying to explain about HP fandom. We are both original series Star Trek fans so were involved in Trek fandom in the 70s and 80s. This was before online fandom, so all correspondence, newsletters, fiction etc was in the old fashioned way (print, letters, telephone, face-to-face). When we did come together for conventions, there were clearly different groups, but some of the groups were considered more important than others. The ‘management’ were those who ran the different UK Star Trek clubs. This wasn’t something that was set up intentionally but rather just happened over the course of time.

When talking about HP fandom, I did call it an online community with lots of groups making up the greater whole. Most of these do link together in the way that groups in RL do as well, and I sometimes see it looking like the rings on the Olympic flag -- all interconnecting with each other.

As to whether there is ‘management’ I guess that would depend which community you originally became involved in. Mine was via FA and HpfGU so it is the people in those groups I am most aware of. But if I had found HP fandom via another group then I would know a different group of people. I do think people look towards the people who run places like FA, etc, as being management because we assume you all know your way around fandom.

[rhiannon333.livejournal.com]

Just a drive-by schnoogle to say: You really, really need a vacation! Please have one and look after yourself!

[covergrlgoddess.livejournal.com]

Honey, you keep this fandom running. I think it's a community more then a fandom. There are some tight knit communitys that could be veiwed as seprete... Also, there is a whole 'nother fandom that the FAPers and the HPFGUers don't look at. Maybe FAP and HPFGUers are a seprete community from the fandom?

All I know for sure is it wouldn't be the same without you. FAP would not be as successful... possibly never happened at all. Besides, a fandom without Heidi would suck. *hugs*

Love,
Mantha

[amandageist.livejournal.com]

I think using the term "HP fandom" is about as useful as using the term "white people." It is an identifier, but there the usefulness ends. It can't tell you specifics about what each person is into or which subset of the fandom they cleave to. HP fandom would seem to me to be a number of communities, and a fan can exist in any of these communities in ignorance of any others with perfect satisfaction.

Of late there seems to be a push to "organize" HP fandom in some way; the list to homogenize how HP lists are run would be an example. I don't see any need for any overarching organization for this set of thriving communities; I think it is over-reaching and meddling and a case of big fishes in little ponds. Organization for the sake of organization, where no need prompted it.

And yes, you need a vacation. Like Snape, what you say and what you do are not the same thing. Snape at least is honest about it. But you protest that you do not have or seek such a management position, with the best of reasons (work restrictions), and still seek to be performing management roles as a behind-the-scenes mover and shaker. Your intentions may be of the best, but to my perception this type of surreptitious control is a threat to the creative and free atmosphere of these communities. Because you will not admit your own ambitions or machinations, you are not able to put any control measures in to counter their effects. It drifts ever towards a clique or in-group. If you want to do this, just say so and get moving on it. And understand that whether you just say so or not, the effects occur.

Perhaps the change in atmosphere I've felt is a natural result of the growth of the groups. But I really don't see as much a need as you to shape and direct the growth.

[heart-of-wine.livejournal.com]

are we a fandom or are we a community? Or are we a fandom that contains a number of communities?

IMHO, we are a fandom that contains a number of communities. I don't think any fandom has just one leader, as far as I know (in my humble experience of only 2 1/2 fandoms).

And do I really, really, need a vacation? Even if you don't, take one anyway! :)

Cheers,
Elia

[nmalfoy.livejournal.com]

I'll go with "You really need a vacation" for 500, Alex.

[loup_noir]

Illegitimi non carborundum! Buck up, kid! You already know my opinion but I'd just like to point out that those who actually do some work always draw the fire. It's sooooo much easier to make snarky comments and not do something.

Be proud of your accomplishments and, yeah, you do need a vacation.

Loff you!

[loup_noir]

And it's also easy to assume that I meant you. But I didn't. Don't take offense where none is given.

[amandageist.livejournal.com]

Apologies; looks like I had a bit of paranoia going and fell to the circumstantial. Comment has been removed.

[(Anonymous)]

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<<<are we a fandom or are we a community? Or are we a fandom that contains a number of communities?>>>

I think the fandom is definitely made up of communites. There is the HP4GU, the FA one, etc. I mean, look at the Sugarquill for example. That's a community if I've ever seen one. Their 'real life' board is much more popular than their HP ones. And I really hope that there is no one leader of the fandom, or that no one ever seeks to hold that position. Talk about a dictatorship. *shudders*

[fede.livejournal.com]

Well, the Harry Potter fandom was my first offical fandom that I ever acted in, for I was a lurker in several Anime fandoms a couple of years ago, so I really can't compare such things.

But I think that the fandom houses communities that those have inner-communities (i.e. those who are active at that site). An example would be FA, SQ, GT, Werewolf Registery, and the list goes on. You make friends (or I have at least) in those communties and so it appears the fandom isn't as large as you would think it would be.

You are ranked high on the list. (I'm wibbling madly at my guts at posting this and hopin that I don't make a fool out of myself. Meep!) I don't know what we'd FAP-ers do if you all (read: admins, mods, elves, e-mentors, nifflers and everybody else that works for FA) decided to call it quits one day. But the only person who I can view as the 'head' of the fandom is JKR, for she ultimatly can change the entire fandom with the release of another book. She could have easily killed it by finding fanfiction.net and requested that it removed.

As for the vacation...Everybody needs a vacation, even when they don't think they need one. ^^